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Came to my house. Hasn't happened in quite a while, years actually, that I've talked to them and I'll explain why and um, lied to me. And I do have it on tape and I'm going to share it with you guys. Not because it's sensational, but because it's educational. The Jehovah's Witness group is a cult. It's a harmful, life ruining, soul destroying cult. And it's good to expose these things. It's good to shine the light on them and help people understand the problems that are there. And I thought that this recording that uh, I'm going to share at least part of it with you is insightful.

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All right, that's question one today. What happened when the Jehovah's Witnesses came to my house? Um, I have one of their documents here. It's going to take a few minutes. And you know me, when I say a few minutes, I mean like 20 minutes or more. I'm going to walk through. This is what happened when they came to my door. Um, first off, they haven't come in a long time. And the reason for that is because I bring out their book, the Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Scriptures, which has the. This is not like a normal New World translation. That, that's right. The JWs that the cult group has their own translation of the Bible called the New World Translation. And it is very problematic. But this is something else they produce alongside of it that even a lot of JWs don't even know about. It's got the Greek and it's got the English right next to each other, right? So here you have the Greek Interlinear. So you have English and Greek on top of one another. And then here you have their New World Translation which is the same thing they study from. I'll come back to that though. When I brought this out last time, um, it resulted in them putting me on some sort of list. And they didn't come to my house for years. They would not only not show up on my street because they would actually be on my street, they would just not come to my house.

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So that was strange. I remember one time actually flagging down Jehovah's Witnesses who were walking down my street and they were walking right past my house. And I knew they were there because I heard them kind of talking. I looked out the little peephole and I see them walking. And you always know it's jws. There's certain clothes they wear, certain speed they walk, they always walk very slow.

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And I opened the door and I flagged them. I said, hey, how's it going? And I was going to try to initiate a conversation because I want to outreach to the people that are caught up in this wrong, uh, belief.

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And they waved me down and said they didn't effectively that they didn't want to talk to me. And they went from my house over or, uh, from my one neighbor's house past me, waved, said, we already talked to you. And they did. This was like a year ago. And then they just kept going. And I never really let them. They never came to my house after that until recently. And that was this conversation. Um, so here's how it went. Two very nice ladies came to my house. Um, I see them as victims of the Watchtower, but also perpetrators because they are out there trying to spread these, this misleading cult information to other people.

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Forgive me. I'm pausing those of you who can't see because you're listening on podcast. I'm pausing occasionally because I'm coughing and hacking still. And that's just been lingering and stuff. But we'll get through it together.

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So the first thing that happened is we did some small talk and then I brought up John 1 and I said, you know, I let them know. I said, I study, uh, the Jehovah's Witness beliefs and I have, um, done some videos on them online. I've done some teaching on this stuff. I teach about the Bible on the Internet. And so the first question they asked was, were you ever associated with the Witnesses, with the watchtower, with the JWs. And the reason they ask this is because if I'm in the category of not just someone, uh, who's in opposition, but rather someone who is a former jw, they're considered apostate. This is like the lowest level of human, and you will be treated differently. They would probably just reprimand me and leave, I imagine, but they would put me in a new category if I was a former jw. So it was important that I let them know I was never a Jehovah's Witness. That way they would continue talking with me. Then we went to John Chapter one. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And I mentioned how the Watchtower adds the Word A there. And this is common knowledge. Um, but I actually didn't want to focus on that. I wanted to focus on what comes right after that, what which in John chapter one, it shows that Jesus is the only non created thing. So John 1, here we go.

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And it says here in this passage, and this is. I'm not saying this is the best thing you could possibly do with a Jehovah's Witness. There's lots of ways to talk to people. But the direction I wanted to go in that moment, with no preparation, of course, um, it says here, all things were made through Jesus, right? And without him was not anything made that was made. Now, their belief is that Jesus does not always existed, so he was made at some point. And so here it's saying that Christ was not made. In fact, everything that was made was made through Him. And this formula here in verse three rules out the idea that Jesus wasn't made. Now, the Watchtower people at my door weren't actually that great at their understanding of Scripture. Usually they'll know John 1 backwards and forwards. When I quoted verse 3 out of off memory, she accused me of jumping from John to the book of Proverbs because there's this proverb stuff about wisdom and the first of his creation. I was the first thing brought forth. And she confused that with John. And anyway, I was like, no, no, this is in John. And at this point I said, tell you what, I have one of your books in my house. Let me go grab it. So I grabbed the interlinear and I come back out and we're talking some more. And then I show them that it is, in fact in there. In fact, on the ring, the ring video was cutting out every 20 seconds. So it's a little choppy and it's hard to hear. But you can see in the video that they are, um, checking John, John 1 as I'm going to get the book. And they're like, oh, it is there. Then I show it to them, and immediately, as soon as she realizes it's there in John 1:3, she immediately cuts me off. This is the normal tactic for all cults, uh, and all people who have false theology.

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Almost always they're going to do the same thing. They're going to stop you mid sentence. At the moment they realize that you actually have a good point, they can't rebut, and they're going to change the subject. So she immediately stopped me. She interrupted me so many times in our discussion. Eventually I started talking, like, louder and more urgently to get words out. And you'll hear that in the clip I'll share with you.

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But the interruption was. But Jesus says, I don't do anything apart from my Father. And this is not a good rebuttal for those who don't believe in the Trinity. This is not a good rebuttal for the Trinity because Trinitarians believe that Jesus didn't do anything apart from the Father. That's part of our Trinitarian belief. So we talked a little bit about that. And I said, this isn't a challenge to the Trinity. She said something else similar. And I said, these aren't challenges to the Trinity. The fact that Jesus has, uh, that God the Father is not a challenge to our beliefs. Do you only understand the Trinity? And then we talked about that for a few minutes. And then she went to Colossians 1. She wanted to get away from John. She wanted to get over to Colossians 1. And it just so happens that I not only have Colossians one ready to go, but I have it marked in my kingdom, interlinear. You see the circles there? What you're seeing on your screen right now, for those who can actually see this, I know it's probably a little difficult. Um, is in those circles, that's where they add words to the Bible. It says here that all things were made through Jesus in Colossians. And they wanted to rebut what I said about John 1:3. So she goes to this passage which says in their translation, all other things were made through Christ. That way you can still say Christ is one of the things that are made. Uh, he's in a created category. So I show her, in her own, own Bible, that they've actually added the word other and that this is their own material. The reason why this is significant and why they put brackets around the word other, which is a normal thing translators do to show they're adding a word.

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Um, this is significant because this gets at the heart of the Watchtower's theology of Jesus. They reject who Jesus is. They reject the true Jesus, and they preach a false Christ. And they have their witnesses going door to door preaching a false Christ. They're false teachers. Everybody who goes door to door is a false teacher. But I can show in their own documents that they have done this. You know, and there's more debates you can have about is it justified or not in the Greek. But I think for the average jw, when they see in their own work that they've added a word, it's disturbing, and it should be because they've been misled and lied to.

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Then she cut off the conversation when I show her the brackets. And I go, these are the brackets. This is what it means. I go, see? They add the word, um, other over and over again here in your text. And, um, There isn't the word other isn't there in the Greek.

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She understandably, was not ready for that conversation, but sadly did not say, let me look at that. Can I take a look at that? Can I get a picture of it? Can I go ask somebody about it?

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Instead, she said, mike, I'm going to cut you off right there.

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And then said, we're out of here. And I. That's when I got my sense of urgency. You're gonna hear this in the clip I'll play for you. It's like a, I don't know, 40, 60 second clip, just audio. Cause I'm not showing you guys my front door. Uh, cause I'm smarter than that to put my front door out there for the world. Um, when I play this audio, you guys will see. Um, I turn up the volume. Definitely. I have a genuine sense of urgency. I'm scared for these ladies lives. I feel like, as they go door to door, what are the chances they're gonna find someone who knows what they're talking about, who might share the truth with them? It's not that great.

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So I just think, can I just put something in their ear? Can I put some bug in their ear that will make them nag at them as they leave? And the last thing you'll notice before you hear the last part of our conversation is, um, the, um, discussion when they said they were going to leave, I said, what you're going to do now is you're going to put me on that list again and never come to my house, right? And she goes, we don't have a list. And I said, I know you have a list. And I told them the whole story. And she goes, well, we have a list, but we only use it when people ask to be put on that list. Would you like to be put on that list? And I go, no. And then, um, I proceed to finish this discussion about the Watchtower, adding. And these people in New York controlling them. So one of the thought controls, last thing you need to know, thought controls that Jehovah's Witnesses do is they tell their people not to research, really do real research. They're only supposed to use the research tool on the Watchtower website, the official Watchtower research tool. In other words, the. The men in New York, the governing body, these leaders of the Jehovah's Witnesses, they tell them, we want you to research, but only research the things we say about everything in the world. Research is asking these guys what they think about everything. And you're not supposed to Google Jehovah's Witnesses. I've confirmed this with multiple JWs I've talked with. You're not allowed to question any group that insulates, that says, if you're part of a church and you're listening to this and your pastor says, don't ever Google my name or things about our church, because you'll find out. You'll just get a bunch of lies. Then go Google and find out, and you can sort through truth and lies on your own. You don't need thought control from your leadership. That's not appropriate. You want to look into the history of Scripture and to the authenticity of the word of God, how we got our Bible. It's going to be hard work. It's going to take your brain. It's going to take a lot of energy. You're not just going to watch the first video you see and think it must all be true, but nobody should be telling you. You can't research and look into these things and actually use your brain. Okay, so here's when I. And it's like 20 second clips that keep cutting out. So I just put them together. This is the last part of our conversation. You'll hear her lie to me. Um, ultimately, she says we are told to research. And then I'm going to offer to give her a book.

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And then she'll say no. And when she says no, it reveals the reality of this. Then at the very end, you'll hear her, um, when I tell them, come back anytime. She goes, would you like us to put you on the don't call.

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Which is weird. It's kind of a Freudian slip, I think, because they're gonna put me on it.

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Here it is.

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Go back to the King James. Go read Colossians 1 and the king James for your own soul's sake. Because there's many false prophets who've gone out into the world, the scripture says. And, um, that's the Watchtower governing body. These men in New York who give you all your instructions, these people who tell you you can't even research. You can only use the Watchtower website. You can't even read other books. You can. I have to use your.

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Now I have to pretend that we are encouraged to do research in other, uh, publications. If I give you. If I give you one, will you hear it?

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What we, um, know is I can give you research that's all about problems with the Watchtower. I can give you a book right now. Will you read it? No. Tell me I'm lying. Well, you are lying.

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I Try to open your eyes. Lying. I do take offense at that because you're telling me to tell the truth. We are encouraged and you can read it in our publications. We are encouraged to do research and, and the watch.

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We were encouraged to do outside research. I would love to see. I'm not going to talk. Why do Jehovah's Witnesses I've talked to tell me that they're told not to Google Jehovah's Witnesses. They're told not to search. They're only told to use the jw.word research tool on the website for who you, uh, talk to. I can only speak for me as one. I would arrive anyway. Have a nice day.

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I'll pray for you ladies.

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If you want to come back, I'm here. Okay. Uh, do you want us to put us put you on that list? Not the pole or what? No. Okay. Someone will be back. Okay.

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Mhm. I laughed because she goes, someone will be back. That was actually March 8th. Today's the 21st. They have not been back. Uh, normally they would have come back the very next Saturday. They, uh, haven't come back. We didn't miss them because we weren't home because we have ring camera. Then it would have caught people at the doors, would have been a video and all that. They, I really doubt anybody's going to be back. Um, in the past they've come back, uh, with like the smart guy in the congregation who like knows Greek or something, um, or at least sort of knows it. And uh, and then they still wrote me off and wouldn't come to my door again. So that was the conversation. Um, the lady, I know some of you are thinking like, mike, that was kind of intense. Like you got a little intense there. And I absolutely did because I was being very honest and open with them and I'm in fear for their souls. And, um, she was in a lot of ways a very nice lady, like outwardly. But she lied to me multiple times. Definitely lied to me multiple times. Continued to lie all the way through to the end. Lied, um, to me even saying, oh, we'll be back.

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Nobody's coming back. Um, the lie about research, I hope you could hear it in the recording where she says, we are encouraged to do research in outside sources other than the Watchtower. And I said, great, I've got this book I will give to you. Um, will you read it? And she says, no.

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The Jehovah's Witnesses, I've tested this many times. They're so conditioned not to even think about any literature or Websites or anything against their stuff, that if you try to hand them a document, like a little tract or something, some information about the Watchtower, they won't even touch it. They won't even put it in their fingers and hold it for a moment and then give it back to you. It's like you could feel the protections, the stronghold that the Watchtower has over them. It's such a disaster. This religion is evil. This religion is a lie. Um, and I've got videos on Jehovah's Witnesses. You guys can just type my name. Mike Winger, Jehovah's Witnesses. It'll all pop right up. Or jw, It'll pop right up.

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And you guys can check that out if you're interested. Um, the reason why I got serious and I said, you're lying to me is because there was this veneer, this totally fake veneer, this. I wasn't even talking to a real person. I was talking to a fake veneer, a salesman for a cult. And I had to push through it and say, I'm calling you out, because there was two ladies at the door. There was the one who was lying to me, and there was the other one who as soon as there was any kind of disagreement, she fell totally silent. And I thought, she knows this lady's lying and she knows I'm calling her out.

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Maybe this will plant a seed in her heart and she'll remember that time this person she thought was like, this godly person loves God and just preaches Jesus and who just lied, bold faced multiple times to that guy as soon as he had disagreements. Hopefully it sticks. So that's my discussion with the Watchtower, with the Jehovah's Witnesses. Um, I doubt they'll be back. It's always possible, but not likely.

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All right, we're going to look at your guys. Questions coming from the live chat. My name is Mike Winger, and my goal is to help you learn to think biblically about everything. And, um, that includes speaking truth, uncomfortable truths to cult members, you know, trying to appeal as gently as you can. But sometimes gentleness is actually going to shoot you in the foot. And you have to be very pointed. And I think that's what I tried. Anyways. Billah has a question. Question number two says, since many saw the saints who were raised to life, Matthew 27, verses 52 and 53, then more than 500 saw Jesus after his resurrection. How is it that so many didn't believe he rose, for instance, Saul before Damascus?

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We have an interesting test case on this. Okay, but for those who don't understand the question, I'll just kind of, like, elaborate on it a bit. There were some pretty amazing miracles around the time of Jesus. There was, of course, his resurrection, Um, I mean, after his death. Um, and then there was these other saints. Matthew talks about who rose. It says many now. Many could have been 4, could have been 12, could have been more. I don't know how many. Um, we don't know how long they were around when they rose. We don't know how long they had been deceased. We don't know any of those types of things. Um, the emphasis in the Gospels is primarily on Jesus resurrection, but Matthew does tell us about that. So there was definitely some amazing miraculous stuff. And your question is how. How is it that people didn't all believe? Why didn't everybody convert if they're seeing Jesus alive after death? And you mentioned the 500 who saw him in a particular meeting. First Corinthians 15 talks about this. There was a moment where 500 people saw Jesus alive after his death.

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Um, that might have been the Sea of Galilee. People theorize this. I think it's a good theory. There's one meeting that Jesus had where he actually arranged for a gathering of people to see him after his resurrection. Every other time we see Jesus appear, it's like spontaneous. Two people on the road to Emmaus, or he comes into the room and the disciples are gathered, or he sees Mary, um, at the. At the tomb. There's these moments where Jesus appears to people and it's sort of unprepared. People didn't know, otherwise everybody would come. But. But there's one time m.

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They were supposed to meet him in galilee. And then 1 Corinthians says over 500 brethren saw him at once. So I think that probably the 500 was the Galilee meeting, which means it was far from Jerusalem. Chances are the people who saw Jesus at Galilee were mostly already his disciples, and they were not people from the Jerusalem area.

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In other words, this information wouldn't have traveled or wouldn't have had as big of an impact in the area around Jerusalem.

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Those particular witnesses. It would be a story of a bunch of people saw him alive far away. It wouldn't be something that would impact, um, the initial starting of the church as much in Jerusalem, where the church really got kicked off. But there was a huge impact. There was a lot more people believed after the resurrection than would have believed before. And so there's several people who saw Jesus alive. He appeared to many. He showed proofs that he Was in fact, alive from the dead. And 5,000 people get saved at Pentecost in one single day. 5,000 people. They believe in Jesus, his resurrection included. That's huge. So there was a huge impact. And then the church just kept growing and growing and growing. I don't want to underestimate how many people did believe and how much the physical evidence of the resurrection played into this.

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This is one of the main preaching points in the book of Acts as proof for the evidence that Christ, you know, as proof for the reality of Christianity is that Jesus rose. And we all. There was many eyewitnesses.

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So it actually did have a big impact.

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All that being said, there's kind of a test case in the Gospels that sort of demonstrate the mentality people may have had where if they're hearing a secondhand testimony that somebody saw Jesus rose, that maybe they wouldn't believe. Remember when Rhoda, this woman, she's in the Book of Acts. Excuse me. This is Acts. Um, Peter's in prison. And they're gathered, praying for Peter, for him to be delivered. Peter gets delivered angelically, miraculously. And he comes to the house.

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Man, I forgot to grab some cough drops.

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Bummer. Um, and, uh, there at the house, he knocks on the door. And the person who answers the door is this lady. I believe her name is Rhoda. Memory says it was Rhoda. And she goes and tells the people Peter's at the door. And their instinctual thought is, no, it's not Peter's. It's his. It's his ghost. Like, Peter died. He was killed in prison, or it's his angel or something. It's not actually him.

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People were. And this I actually like. They were naturally skeptical of resurrection, accounts of appearances of Jesus, that kind of thing. They were naturally skeptical of this. We even find Thomas. Look at that. I have the most amazing wife. She overheard me saying I needed cough drops.

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Marry well, my friends.

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Hopefully that'll help out, and I won't be interrupting myself as much.

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Think, um, of Thomas. Thomas, one of the 12. He hears his buddies telling him that Jesus has risen, that they've seen him with their own eyes. The gathered disciples, the other 10, they tell him we saw him. And Thomas says, I wasn't here. Unless I see him and touch him, I'm not even going to believe. Now, he should have believed. Like it would have been reasonable for him to have that many people he knows that well, who he knows were predisposed to not believe. Christ rose, right? They thought he was. It was over for Them to then suddenly believe this was really good evidence he should have received. He could have interviewed them, asked him questions, but he didn't. He disbelieved. He was naturally skeptical of the resurrection of Christ. This is super significant to me. In the New Testament, we don't have a bunch of gullible backwater hick. You know the cliche. Oh, they're just like these Bronze Age authors. They don't know what. They don't know what's going on and up from down, and they believe anything and everything. They don't. They didn't believe Peter was even released from prison. They didn't believe that, um, that Jesus, many of them, that Jesus had risen until they saw more and more evidence. They gave up. Jesus predicted he would rise, and the disciples gave up. After his crucifixion, multiple times, he said he would rise. They didn't believe it.

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This is good for us. It means that the ones who did believe had to overcome their own credulity in order to do so. So their testimonies should be taken with a little more weight, a little more power when they do, in fact, believe. So there's things that happen around that time that help increase the trustworthiness of the veracity of the testimonies of the apostles, the disciples.

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Paul, uh, is a great. Another great example of this. This man was persecuting the church. He was disposed to be against it, to hate it, to oppose it, and he ends up converting. Why? Because he says he saw Jesus himself.

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I mean, that's pretty impressive. All right, let's go to the next question.

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Um, we got all of our questions for today. We're full up all 10. Levi Venner says. I'm sorry, that's last week. Uh, last time. It's been a few weeks, actually. Um, this is from Austrius, next gen, who says in Galatians 3, Paul says, Faith, not law, saves us. Citing Abraham's heirs, how would he respond to judaizers, citing Genesis 17, 9, 14, on circumcision as necessary? Why does this apply now? I'm gonna have to unpack this question for myself to understand it better. Um, as I read it, it was just hard for me to track it, so maybe others are with me on that. Let's see, Galatians 3.

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Um, we know that in the. In. The problem with the Galatians, of course, is they're, uh, being told that they have to not only be circumcised, they're being told they have to obey the law of Moses, Circumcision has to be seen in that context. The Galatians are being told, you have to be circumcised as part of your commitment to be under the law of Moses, as part of your conditions for whether you will be saved or not saved. You're not really a Christian. You're not really forgiven. You're not really in Christ unless you get circumcised and come under the law of Moses. That's what they're being taught. Paul, he absolutely rejects this 100% thoroughly. And he doesn't even say that circumcision is good. Circumcision is something you ought to do, but you don't have to do to be saved. He doesn't even say that. He doesn't say, obey the law, and it's good, you should do it, but it's not required for salvation. No, no, he rejects the whole thing. You're not under the law. And he tells them, don't get circumcised in that circumstance, don't even do it. So in verse seven, he says, know then that it is those who are, uh, of faith who are the sons of Abraham. If you're asking, like, how do I, how do I get the, the, the, the grace of God through the promises to Abraham, Do I have to obey the law? And he goes, no, no, you have to have. Be a son. You have to be a person of faith, because Abraham was a person of faith. And, um, you mentioned verse seven, but you also mentioned verses 28 and 29. We could read all of this, and I would recommend you guys do if you want to get more details on Galatians. But the verses you mentioned, there, uh, is neither Jew nor Greek. There is neither slave nor free. There is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise.

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I am, uh, grafted in through Jesus, not through Moses. That's like a short version of it.

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Now you say, how would he respond to judaizers, citing Genesis 17, 9, 14?

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Let's just read the passage.

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I can't pretend to speak for Paul here, but I can respond for myself.

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And God said to Abraham, as for you, you shall keep my covenant, you and your offspring after you, throughout their generations. This is my covenant, which you shall keep between me and you and your offspring after you. Every male among you shall be circumcised.

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You shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be A sign of the covenant between me and you. He who is eight days old among you shall be circumcised. Every male throughout your generations, whether born in your house or bought with your money from any foreigner who is not of your offspring, both he who's born in your house and he who's bought with your money shall be. Shall. Shall surely be circumcised. So shall my covenant be in your flesh. An everlasting covenant. Any uncircumcised male who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin shall be cut off from his people. He has broken my covenant.

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Um, so one thing to understand here. There's probably a lot that could be discussed. We could talk about covenants and all that kind of stuff. But let me just say, when Paul spoke to the Galatians about not getting circumcised, he was not talking to Jews, he was talking to Gentiles.

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How does a Gentile enter into the grace of God that was promised to and through Abraham?

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By faith in Jesus?

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Jesus, who was circumcised on my behalf, who was, um, under the law on my behalf, who became a human on my behalf, who did the obedience of every single thing on my behalf, who vicariously died on the cross for my sins on my behalf, he did everything for us. If I have Jesus, I've got the law and the circumcision in Jesus. And this is how Paul, I think, talks about this. Um, that in Christ we have everything. We have the fulfillment of all of the requirements of law, including something like this. This is through Jesus, through his circumcision, his obedience, His. All of that.

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That being said, Jews in the early church were often usually circumcised. We even have this complicated set of examples in the Book of Acts, where we have Jews who continue to observe many of the things in the law of Moses. They go to the temple, they even do sacrifices in the Book of Acts.

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But Gentiles, they're told, you do not have to do these things. So if there's like a heritage and you're Jewish and you want to be doing more of that stuff, you certainly have that liberty. If you're trying to tell Gentiles, or even other Jews for that matter, that they have to do it or they're not saved, that Jesus isn't enough, that his circumcision isn't enough to be on their behalf, if you're going to tell us that Jesus isn't enough, that's what Galatians is for. And That's, I think, how Paul would respond. Um, yeah, that's pretty much the short version. Now, there's plenty of scripture we could quote on this, but I'd say read Galatians and see this and see that. It's the vicariousness of what Jesus did for us. Um, he did it on our behalf. He fulfilled all those things, all those requirements. So they are requirements, but they're requirements Jesus fulfilled. All right, let's go to question number three.

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That was number three. Four. Anonymous question. My brother asked me to officiate his wedding. They're not believers, and I'm female. Ah. The only way to do it is to get ordained online. It feels like mocking God in his church. Biblical thoughts. Um, this is super tough for me. Okay. I'm going to get heat for this. So I recognize ahead of time I'm going to get heat and maybe I'll give the wrong answer on this. And you guys are welcome to bring me heat and correct me. I'm not above correction. Those who are above correction just stay wrong.

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Um, there's a few layers. Okay. This is a complicated question to me. To some, it's easy. To me, it's complicated. Here's why. One, there's no biblical requirement that anybody marries you in some sort of special capacity. Um, marriage is a public covenant, right? It's a covenant between a man and woman, but it's public. Everybody knows about it. That's important. Everybody knows about it. But you don't have to have special people that do the marrying thing. Okay? The two people making the commitment, that's the thing. I think that's necessary.

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So it's also not up to. Let's say a pastor gets asked to marry somebody. Um, it's not up to that guy whether those people can get married, are worthy of getting married, or allowed to get married. I don't think that kind of authority resides in the pastor or in the government or anybody else. I think that this is really weird to think that they have that kind of role.

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But if you want to have them there, and I did at my wedding. We have multiple pastors that were part of our wedding, and that was important to us. But we were like, we could have gotten married at a justice of the peace. That would have been a public element, Right? Where we're making it official. That would have been just equally valid. Our marriage would have been equally valid. Um, so I don't think that.

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I don't think that I have the right to tell people they can and can't get married. Now I can tell them I don't want to participate in this wedding. Maybe I don't approve in some sense, but it's not my right to stop them. Like, I have no control over who marries who. But I may not participate or I may not be involved. Um, and of course, if you're thinking that any of this applies to, like, a gay marriage or something like that, uh, no, that's not marriage. It's not what marriage is. Okay? This is apples and oranges. They're different things. Uh, a gay marriage is a imitation. It's the same thing as a trans person saying, I'm a woman when they're really a man. It's like, you're not. You're not a man. You're just calling your. You're not a woman. You're just calling yourself that, um, to your own harm.

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So another layer. Um, you're a woman, and you're being put in a position that is, at least in our culture, typically seen as a pastoral role. Does it have to be pastoral role? I've already said it doesn't. No. Anybody can do a wedding, but it's typically seen as a pastoral role. And you may feel uncomfortable saying, hey, if you, like me, understand the scripture very clearly teaches the complementarian ideas about men and women and their roles in the church and their roles in relationship and marriage, then you may well feel uncomfortable doing that wedding for a reason that has nothing to do with who you're marrying and just says, I don't think this is appropriate for me to do the wedding. I think that you should have a spiritual leader. If you're going to have someone in this role who does the marrying, I think it should be a spiritual leader. Now, they're not believers. Maybe they don't have a spiritual leader for that. I would get some counsel from your own church on this. Um, but I would not violate your own conscience on that topic.

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I would lean towards not being comfortable doing it personally. And you might be like, but it's a witness, and I can use it as a witness. That's true. You can use it as a witness. And maybe that's a good enough justification. Um, it's not my judgment call to make. It's ultimately yours. But it's tough because when you add all the things together you can use as a witness, you can start sliding into compromise pretty quickly. So you want to be careful with that. Um, I don't think it's a mockery of God in his church for two unbelievers to get married. Marriage is a holy union, whether the people are believers or not, whether they recognize it or not.

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Whoever gets married, if it's a real marriage, it's a real thing. It's not a mockery of God, I don't think. Um, the sad thing is they're rejecting God and rejecting Christ and they need Jesus. But. But I would hope the best for their marriage and all that. There's some layers for you. Um, I guess I would probably want more time to think about this, to sit down and ask you questions. Biblically speaking, anybody can get married, Anybody, whether they have an officiant or not. Culturally speaking, that's usually a pastoral role. So you, as a woman, I would think most women would probably feel uncomfortable if they have a biblical view of the role differences. Um, but then you've got the layer of it's your family, they're asking you to do it, and all this sort of thing, the getting ordained online thing. Um, yeah, to me, it doesn't mean anything if you can go and just fill out a thing and get it. I would just think of it as a certificate to perform a service and then never tell anybody about it and not consider yourself actually ordained.

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Anyway, those are the layers you guys can give your thoughts down below. And, uh, maybe. Maybe I'll find some better advice in the comments. Okay. Question number five. Alicia Carter says, hey, Mike, can you explain Daniel 10:13 and verse 20? What is the spirit prince of the kingdom? Persia? That's what the new living translation says. Spirit prince is the concept of a spirit prince over a region only seen in the Old Testament. Or can this happen today?

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Heavy question. Let's dig in. Daniel, chapter 10.

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We're gonna have to read a chunk of this to understand it better. All right, um.

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In those days, um, I. Daniel was mourning for three weeks. I'm starting in verse two. And because. Because he knows bad things are going to happen. He's had dreams, like visions of crazy bad stuff. And now he's like, what does it mean? So he's mourning for three weeks. I ate no delicacies, no meat or wine entered my mouth, nor did I anoint myself at all for the full three weeks. On the 24th day of the first month, I was standing on the bank of the great river that is the Tigris. I lifted up my eyes and looked, and behold, a man clothed in linen with a belt of. I lost my place of fine, uh, gold from Ufaz around his waist. His body was like beryl, his face like the appearance of lightning, his eyes like flaming Torches, his arms and legs like the gleam of burnished bronze. So he's, like, exuding light, I think, is what we're getting. He's. He's reflecting and exuding light.

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And the sound of his words, like the sound of a multitude. You know what's interesting? In Scripture, they didn't have speakers and amplification. They didn't have bombs and jet engines. What they had, as the loudest things they had were storms, uh, the waves of the ocean.

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Waterfalls, actually.

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Waterfalls. And multitudes. Large numbers of people all shouting. And so they had. When they wanted to say that when it was loud, they had to compare it. So he spoke. It was the sound of a multitude. And I, Daniel alone, saw the vision. For the men who were with me did not see the vision. But a great trembling fell upon them, and they fled to hide themselves. Just. Just they felt the fear of this powerful being that was before them. So I was left alone, and I saw this great vision. And no strength was left in me. My radiant appearance was fearfully changed, and I retained no strength. Then I heard the sound of his words. And as I heard the sound of his words, I fell on m My face in deep sleep with my face to the ground. This is a powerful and terrifying moment. And behold, a hand touched me and set me trembling on my hands and knees. And he said to me, oh, Daniel, a man greatly loved. What an encouraging word after all that terror. A man greatly loved. Understand the words that I speak to you and stand upright, for now I've been sent to you. This isn't God, Jesus. This is an angelic being. And it's kind of cool to see in this passage the combination of the power and terror of the spiritual realm, as well as the love and comfort of being in God's favor. And they're both present at the same time. There is this. God is not neutered. God is not weak. God is not impotent and incapable of bringing wrath. He has wrath, and he does bring it. And it's healthy for us to see him with that power and tremble, but then to hear him, you know, touch our shoulder and say, oh, you are greatly loved. Look at the cross. And that's just a cool picture that Daniel went through there that we can go through with Jesus. Understand the words that I speak to you and stand upright, for now I've been sent to you. And when he'd spoken this word to me, I stood up trembling. Then he said to me, fear not, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to Understand and humbled yourself before the. Before your God. Your words have been heard, and I have come because of your word. So it was three weeks between the moment he prayed and the arrival of this angelic being who we'll learn more about.

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And, um, he was going to explain why there was a delay. And this is what this question is about. Why was there a delay? Verse 13. The prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me 21 days. That's the three weeks. But Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I was left there with the king of Persia and came to make you understand what is to happen to your people in the latter days. For the vision is for days yet to come.

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This is super cool, actually, right? I mean, we get insight into the spiritual realm that when Daniel starts to pray and there's a delay in the answer. God doesn't answer Daniel directly. He dispatches an angelic being to go and speak to Daniel, but that. That being is delayed. He's delayed by some sort of force. The prince of the kingdom of persia withstood him 21 days. And so he is somehow being trapped, being held back, being prevented from going to Daniel to speak to him. And it's m. Not until Michael, one of the chief princes, who. The scripture specifically shows that Michael has a relationship with Israel, who stands watch over the people of Israel, came to help me, for I was left there with the kings of Persia.

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Wow. Kings of Persia. Um, uh, notice this. We know Michael's an angel and he's called a chief prince. So this royal language, it's fitting in verse 13 that the royal language is of angelic beings and not just human princes or kings. He's talking about angelic beings. Um, so if there are angelic beings in high places that are opposing you in Persia, we're talking about Satan and his dominion. Whether it was Satan himself or if it was something else, uh, you know, one of his minions, one of his higher ranking. However that works in the spiritual realm.

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That is how I understand this passage. Um, that this is a spirit. You know, you said, uh, that NLT has spirit prints, you know, that kind of works. They're trying to kind of make it clear to people that this is not a physical human king. This is like a spiritual being who is in a royal place. But we also know when, um, for instance, Jesus is being tempted by Satan in the New Testament because you said, is the concept of a spirit prince over a region only seen in the Old Testament? Or can this happen today? It can happen today. So we've got the temptation, uh, of Jesus, where Satan shows him all the kings of the world. And he says, all these have been given to me, and I give them to whoever I please.

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Bow down and worship me and it'll all be yours. Jesus refuses this, but the statement. I don't want to get too much theology from Satan here, but the statement isn't challenged, and it's actually affirmed in other places in the New Testament. So we know it really seems true because he's the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now is at work in the sons of disobedience. He's the one who's over the world. He's the God of this age, Satan. Scripture says he's not an actual God. He's the God, blasphemous, lowercase G God of this age, of this world.

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Um, Satan is the one who is doing all kinds of stuff. Satan put it into the heart of Judas Iscariot to kill Jesus. Satan coordinated the chief priests and, um, Pilate to kill Jesus. He is a puppet master. That's what he is. And it seems he can put his different minions in charge of different regions. Now in Revelation, in the letters to the churches, I think it was pergamum, he says, I, um, know where you are, where Satan's throne is, that this city in particular is a specific throne of Satan. There's some kind of special, um, stronghold of the enemy in this location.

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So, yeah, Old and New Testament seem consistent that there is spiritual warfare, there's spiritual battles we can't see and don't really fully comprehend. And I don't like going into too much m. Conjecture about it because people get weird and they.

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They make it fit into their box, and then they start fabricating stories and stuff like that. And I don't want to do that, but I want to not say less than scripture.

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Satan is definitely active in the world. He is not currently bound. I don't believe. That's not my eschatology. Um, and his entities that do have strongholds in different places. And there really is a spiritual battle that goes on in the White House and a spiritual battle that goes on in the Kremlin. And there's a spiritual battle that goes on. You name the country.

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That stuff is real. What does it look like? I don't know. I don't know. But we just know that it exists because it's definitely in scripture.

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All right, number six, overthinking. It has a question. Nice YouTube name you got there. And, um, for those who don't know. I take these live chat questions from the YouTube live chat, even though this does go up on podcast everywhere, every kind of podcast, and it may appear in other places and clips and different things like that, but we just take the cues from the live chat. If you catch me live, which is usually on Fridays, typically Friday at 1pm Pacific Time or California time, that's when I go live, uh, and do Q&As.

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All right, number six, overthinking. It says, how can the entire community of Israel, more than a million people, fit together and gather to hear?

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And then you've given several verses on this, and I'm going to give you a complicated answer. Unfortunately, I'd rather not. But that's the one I got.

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Um, okay, the verse 8 Leviticus 8:3. It says, and assemble all the congregation at the entrance of the tent of meeting. And Moses did as the Lord commanded him, and the congregation was assembled at the entrance. And then Moses addresses them. Verse 5. Right. This is the thing that the Lord has commanded, and he does all this stuff. Now, if you have a million people, you know, there's people in the back, they're like, I can't even see, let alone hear whatever is going on up there. It's something I'm completely unaware of. Um, if you have a million, if you even have just a large number of people, let's say it wasn't a million. Let's say it was just some smaller amount, but a really significant amount. You had 20,000 people, good luck all hearing it. You don't have a facility that's designed for that. You don't have cameras zooming in and putting people on screens. You don't have amplification. Deuteronomy 29:10. Another verse, verse 10 through 12. You are standing today, all of you, before the Lord, your God, the heads of your tribes, your elders and your officers, all the men of Israel, your little ones, your wives, and your sojourner who is in your camp. From the one who chops your wood to the one who draws your water so that you may enter into the sworn covenant of the Lord your God, which the Lord your God is making with you today.

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There's, um, even times where the people have to respond, vocally respond to statements that are made and stuff. Um, I could read the other verses. There's, uh, Deuteronomy 31, verses 10 to 13 you mentioned, but just try to think a little creatively.

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If you lived back then and you wanted to hear what Moses had to say, but you knew that there was too many people. Not everybody will get to hear them. What would be the things you would naturally do? Well, you might naturally. Oh, I never put that on your screen. What a loser am I. Um, it is there now. Um, what you would naturally do, perhaps, is send representatives. I send the elder or I send the person who has the great memory, you know, and I send people to represent us, especially if they're an elder. They can actually speak on our behalf. Then they can come back and then tell us, as we're gathered together, tell us what was said.

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Do you see that there's a relaying of information that can happen? And that way you can still say, Moses told everybody this. And the congregation responded with this, because their representatives were present hearing and then responding and then going and telling the people what just happened. We also know in the verse you just gave me here that specifically you're standing today, all of you, right? The heads of your tribes, your elders, your officers. And then it goes on and it says, and all the people, even the kids, everybody.

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But we do have a singling out of the leaders. The leaders had a special role in the group gathering that is consistent with this possibility.

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It's also true that, um, they may have had some sort of relaying type going on. We know when Ezra was gathering with the people and he was teaching them, doing the reading of the law, the priests were spread out amongst the people. So there's a large gathering of individuals and there's priests spread out in different locations in this big gathering. And Ezra reads the law, and then they explain the thing he just read. And so this, this, this seems like maybe they're close enough to hear him. And then they repeat what he says, and then they answer questions, and then he does another reading section, and then they repeat and answer. So you may. There may have been like a little sort of like a baton, like, you know, like a relay race. Like, you know, somebody close enough to hear the speaker hears it and then. And then shouts it further so others can hear it. There's some pretty simple ways to try to navigate, to answer the question that you're talking about. So those are some of my thoughts on that. The, um, only other thing I'll add is. No, I won't. Never mind. I think that was good enough. I guess I won't make it as complicated as I don't need to. I'll leave you in mystery. What else was he gonna say? I must know. It was earth shattering. It was so important. No, probably not. All right, next question number seven. Sarah Eniola says, if penal substitutionary atonement is an accurate doctrine, then isn't it contradicting Proverbs 17:15? Love your ministry. Thank you for your question, Sarah.

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Um, Proverbs 17:15.

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He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous, both alike are, ah, both alike. An abomination to the Lord.

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So, um, the idea here is that penal substitutionary atonement is incompatible with Proverbs 17 because it violates it somehow. Um, so I suppose it would be God would have to be the one that's doing the violation. Because if you said, well, Pilate condemned the righteous, yeah, but we don't need to preserve Pilate's integrity or innocence for our doctrine to hold true. We don't concede that guy as integrous and innocent.

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But if God was doing something wrong by punishing Christ for my sins on the cross, effectively condemning the righteous, then you would have to have a new concept of condemning the righteous or a new concept of what it meant that Jesus was on the cross. And those who want to say that God the Father didn't condemn the righteous Jesus to the cross would have to have some sort of rescue for that. Um, now if you reject psa, penal substitutionary atonement, the idea that Jesus suffered the punishment penalty for my sins as my substitute on the cross, taking my place and your place and all of our place, the substitute for all mankind, and that this brought, um, forgiveness of my sin and fixed my relationship with God through atonement. That biblical, kind of like old school Mosaic idea of getting atonement. If, um, you want to reject this, then you're gonna, I guess you want to have an idea that the cross that says that Jesus was not condemned on the cross by the Father, that the Father was not somehow condemning him, even though the Father led him to a death penalty that was a death penalty that represents dying, at least represents dying for sins.

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Right. You can't argue against that. If you're opposed to psa, I don't think reasonably you can. Um, I guess what I'm hinting at is I don't see how rejecting PSA gets you away from the problem of Proverbs 17:15.

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You would still have the Father sending the Son to the cross.

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Now, uh, they could say, well, but he wasn't condemning him. Okay, well, what do you think condemning means? He sent the Son to the cross.

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The Father never. On penal substitutionary atonement, the Father never said the Son was guilty of committing sins. He was treated as guilty because of the sins you committed. So he was never condemned in the sense of him having committed sins. Jesus is not on the cross. Jesus, you sinned, you're a sinner.

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But in another sense, that's different but important. He became sin on the cross. He embodied the punishment, uh, all of the individuals who should be suffering for their sins on the cross, and he suffered for our sins.

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He was innocent, yet in a sense, he was condemned. He was sent to the cross to die for us. But never was he guilty of having committed any actual sin. And never, at any point did the Father, um, condemn Jesus in the sense of saying, you are guilty of having committed some sort of sin. Instead, he was pleased. He was the spotless Lamb, the Lamb without blemish, the one who went to the cross having never compromised or sinned or did anything wrong ever. So if you understand the doctrine of psa, I don't think that this verse is a challenge to it, because what Proverbs is going against here is not a general condemnation of Jesus having been condemned to the cross, but a judgment of, I'm going to say that you sinned in ways you didn't. And God never did this. The Father never did this to the Son on the cross.

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Pilate did, the Pharisees did, but the Father didn't do that. There's a different kind of. You could call it condemnation. I don't know if I would use that term.

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Um, but it's a different kind of thing that Jesus did on the cross. And it was for my sin. Um, but, yeah, my sin was condemned, in a sense, on the cross.

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And Jesus, he represents that, but he wasn't himself actually sinned. He is somehow, um, forsaken, yet approved at the cross at the same time. That is more of the PSA view, I think. I hope that helps. I hope that helps. Um, I am shocked at how much opposition there is to the doctrine of penal substitutionary atonement and those who are opposed to it. You're probably shocked that I'm shocked, okay. Where obviously, we don't see eye to eye on this, and I don't condemn you over it, but, um.

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But I have looked at those arguments and I have spent a lot of time on it. I did a series on the doctrine. I'll link it down below. Um, it didn't get a lot of attention, but I think it's a very important doctrine, and I hope that some of you who need it will watch it. Um, yeah. Anyway, that's all I'll say about that. I'll link down below that series, and I'll go to the next question. Eliza says, number eight. What gives people the will to live in the midst of terror, hardship, poverty, pain, child abuse, loss, and all other types of calamity?

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Specifically non Christians, but also Christians.

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Um, that's a tough question, Eliza. I'm not sure if I have the answer to that question. I mean, I think that if you want to bring scripture into it, I think that the fear of death is something that pervasively throughout scripture is seen as an, As a human thing. We all have a natural fear of death. Some people say they don't fear death, um, and maybe because they've overcome it through something, but they have a natural fear of death. Or maybe because they're so young that they haven't actually seriously thought about death yet. Right. Like later on they'll start to more seriously think about it. They get a little bit older, and then they'll be realized. Oh, I do fear death, actually. I just, I just thought I was not afraid of death. Um, I'm just saying that because I think that that's, um, that's even how I was when I was young. When I was a teenager, I would have been like, I don't think I'm afraid to die. Um, you get a little older and you realize that there are plenty of things to fear, even for a Christian to fear about death. Although I don't have to fear what happens after I die if I'm in Christ, doesn't mean death itself isn't scary.

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Um, I just don't have to fear being condemned, that kind of evil. No, I think it's natural to struggle with some of that stuff.

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But that fear of death could be part of what keeps people going. They keep going. I think also in the midst of terror. You're asking my opinion. I'm going way off the reservation, um, with my opinion here. But I would say, Eliza, even in the midst of terror, hardship, poverty, pain, child abuse, loss, and other calamities, there are often wonderful things that are still part of your life and you still have stuff that you're holding on to that's wonderful and it can. I think what really gets people down is when they feel like all the things that are shiny and good in life, all the things that are blessing, that are enjoyable, when they start not enjoying any of that stuff either. Um, they don't have any friendships, they don't have any source of joy in their life. I think that's when they lose their hope. But, um, Christianity, man, it gives you such Courage for hardship.

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If you're a non believer and you're listening, I want you to just think for a second, objectively just consider this fact that me as a Christian, I can honestly say I believe that every single thing in my life is being used by God for some purpose. And that is incredibly encouraging to me. Even in the midst of all the things we just described that I go, this was terrible. But I know that God is doing something with it and that is very encouraging to me. I don't know what the thing is. I'm not smart enough to put it, uh, all together and figure out God's plan. But I know he told me he's got a plan and that all things work together for good to those who love God and are called according to his purpose. This doesn't mean that everything that happens is up giving me more money, more health, more happiness. But there's some sort of good that God is bringing out of it that is incredibly encouraging. If you're a non believer, I think you should at least go, huh, that's kind of a nice thing that you guys got over there, Christians. You got this like really helpful thing in some of the darkest days of our lives. I also have the knowledge of that this world is passing and that there's another world coming that is eternal and, and that is perfect and that is wonderful. So that all of my things I'm going through. Paul calls it light affliction. I'm blown away by this Paul the apostle who had lost people, who had seen people killed, Paul who had been beaten, who had probably suffered long term physical disablement because of being stoned and being attacked, who had been suffered in prison, shipwrecked, um, been defamed, people who once loved him, hated him, all that stuff.

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Paul calls it all a momentary light affliction.

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He calls it a momentary light affliction in light of the things that we will have one day in heaven. He says it's not even worth comparing. This momentary light affliction.

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Was Paul including loss of a child in that? That's insulting, right? No. Well, losing a child is not a light affliction in any way, except when you're in heaven and you are with that child again, and you are in their presence and you are experiencing the joy of holding them in your arms again. Now, it was a momentary light affliction compared to eternity together again. This gives people hope and courage for the things that they go through in their lives.

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But, um, but yeah, in fact, we find that sometimes people in poverty have A lot more happiness and appreciation in their lives than the people who have wealth.

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Interesting. But people do lose hope.

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And I don't know how a non Christian can. Ultimately, I think as a non Christian, you can't look beyond this life very easily. If you don't believe in heaven, if you don't understand there's an afterlife, it's difficult to look beyond this life for hope.

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You can try to be like, I'm gonna keep pressing on for the sake of my kids or my grandkids or something. And that's some motivation there for sure. But life is pretty dark if this is all there is.

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It gets pretty dark. Thankfully, there's a lot more. Number nine, uh, rev. As Dunn says, I'm worried I'm gonna read a name that's gonna be, like, inappropriate and I won't know it. One of these days, someone will slip it through.

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It's going to happen. All right. Um.

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In the garden of Gethsemane, Jesus prays for God to let the cup pass from him. I've understood the cup to be God's wrath. But Jesus says a few chapters later that James and John will drink it too. Thanks. I think you have hit on something very important.

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Speaking of the doctrine of penal substitutionary atonement, it is often stated that the cup that Jesus drank was the cup of God's wrath. Because Jesus says, let this cup pass from me, and then he ends up drinking. It's a metaphor. Uh, he's in the garden, he's about to go to the cross. He's like, saying, I don't want to go to the cross. I don't desire this. Like, this is really hard, and let it pass. But nevertheless, your will be done, you know, not mine. And then the commentary, the pro PSA guy, who I am, will say, revelation talks about the cup of God's wrath being poured out on the world, being poured out on unbelievers. That's the cup of God's wrath. They're going to have to drink that cup. So they, they then bring them together. So what was the cup Jesus drank in the garden? Well, it was the cup of God's wrath. And this proves that. That the Lord, uh, Jesus drank God's wrath, which proves penal substitutionary atonement. Okay, I do not use this argument. I think this is a bad argument. I know it's been used by major teachers. I know Paul Washer uses it very powerfully. I don't think it's biblical and for the exact reason that you said. In fact, I talked about this, I think in my, in my series on psa, which again, I'll link in the playlist, I'll link the playlist down below.

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But the reason for it is that is Jesus says to James and John that they are also going to drink the same cup Jesus drank.

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There's no way in the Gospel of John that Jesus can be referring to that cup as wrath. If James and John are also going to drink it, they're not going to drink God's wrath. They are forgiven by Jesus Christ. They're not going to partake of God's wrath on behalf of somebody else. This is a useful thing for proving a true doctrine, but it is a wrong use of scripture for a right end or right purpose. Never quote a verse to prove a true thing if that verse isn't about that thing. You know, like every teacher's probably done this at some point and went, well, I was teaching something true, but I used a verse that wasn't true, wasn't about that thing. That was a mistake. Um, let me show you guys if I can find, um, the exact passages.

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Um, actually, here we are in Matthew.

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Um, okay, what cup is Jesus referring to? And then I'll give you the answer. What do I say the cup is? I think it's an easy answer. I think it doesn't defeat the doctrine of PSA or anything like that. Not at all. Um, it just doesn't do what some say it does. Matthew 20, uh, 21. The mother of James and John go to Jesus, and he says, what do you wish? And she says to him, grant that these two sons of mine may sit, one your right hand and the other on your left in your kingdom.

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Now she's talking about, like Jesus, you're going to have an earthly kingdom. You're going to rule right now. Let them be your number one and number two guys, you know, your, your, your, your two highest disciples. And Jesus answered and said, you do not know what you ask because he was going to go to the cross, not the throne. Are you? So they were going to have to sit on the crosses with him? No, no, that's not going to work for you. Are you able to drink the cup that I'm about to drink and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? And he's talking about his death here. And they said to him, we are able. So he said to them, you will indeed drink my cup and be baptized with the baptism I am baptized with. But to sit on my right hand and, um, on my left is not mine. To give, but it is for those for whom it is prepared by my Father.

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They're going to drink the cup. Sorry, I did it again. There it is on your screen. He's going to drink. They're going to drink the cup of Jesus. What cup is that? Well, it's not wrath.

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Theologically, that doesn't work.

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It's suffering.

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They're going to drink the cup. They too will suffer for Christ's name. They too will be killed for Christ, face death, at least for Christ. And they'll drink and they'll be baptized with that same thing.

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The cup represents suffering. Now, the suffering of Jesus, was it suffering the punishment for my sins? Yes, Scripture makes that clear. But do I call that cup, that specific cup, an analogy for the wrath of God? No, I do not. If you want to talk about why I think we should consider Jesus as having, um, experienced God's wrath in a sense, in a specific sense. Not that God's displeased with Jesus and mad at Jesus, none of that. But in a sense of the outpouring of God's judgment, we could call that God's wrath in a sense. Right, then you can see my playlist. I'll share that with you guys down below. I have a specific view that I try to promote with Scripture.

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Don't use a verse to prove a good doctrine. Even if that's not what that verse teaches. There's a lesson for you. Someone tell Paul Washer for me.

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I'm just. I'm gonna get myself in trouble. All right, last question. Does the Antichrist die or not at Christ's coming?

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Um, 2nd Thessalonians 2. 8 and Revelation 19:20 are the two relevant passages. Let's look at those two passages and see what you're thinking about.

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So, disclaimer. For anybody who doesn't know this, I have a pre millennial view of eschatology, if you're familiar with that. Um, 2nd Thessalonians 2. 8. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with the power, with all power and false signs and wonders, with all wicked deception for those who are perishing because they refuse to love the truth and so be saved.

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Um, the other verse you have is 1920.

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And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who is in the presence, who in its presence, the presence of the beast, had done the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with sulfur, and the rest were slain by the sword that came from the mouth of him who was sitting on the horse.

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Um, so I guess the difference that you're looking at is one is saying they're thrown alive into the lake of fire, and the other one is kill, uh, with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.

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Um, yeah, these.

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I'm. I'm inclined to think that they're both true surprise. And what Jesus does in second Thessalonians 2. Eight is a summary statement. That is Jesus, his command. He will simply come. He will end them not by fighting and battling them, but he will end them by commanding their end. With the breath of his mouth, he kills them. So you combine this with Revelation 19, and perhaps his command is cast them alive into the lake of fire. They're cast down lake of fire. It's the breath of his mouth. It's his command. And then they are destroyed that way.

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Um, and they experience a type of death. That would be how I would put those two together.

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Uh, maybe after more thought we'd have something else to share about it, but that's kind of what I have to say about it. So you guys, listen, I'll give you a little update on the stuff I'm working on. I have opened several cans of worms. They're very serious cans of worms. They're very, very serious. And, um, I've put out a request, and this was actually just on Twitter where I shared this, um, and Facebook, but I didn't even do it on YouTube. Um, I shared for people who have experienced certain kinds of, uh, spiritual abuse.

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And we're aware of, like, corruption, especially in the hyper charismatic side of things, that they could reach out, especially if it was like leaders that are significant in the movement that need to be exposed. And I will be exposing several people in the coming. In coming months. I'm working behind the scenes, I'm interviewing witnesses, I'm gathering data, I'm confirming things. I'm trying to do my job to make sure that it's true and fair and just and the things I share. Um, but this might sound weird because you don't have the data yet. You will eventually. I'll make the video. I'll put all. Several videos. I'll put all the data and stuff in there. But there has just been too many abusive, manipulative frauds Using the name of Jesus to pretend that they're prophesying and pretend that they're healing people and pretend that they're doing all these things. And they have tons of sincere followers. People, even some of their leadership teams are sincere and they really love the Lord and they're all just being misled by power hungry narcissistic abusers and they, uh, need to be exposed. They um, need to be removed from influencing the body and leading people. Absolutely. So those are strong words and I mean it 100%.

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The uh, so I'm doing research, I'm looking into stuff and I'll be sharing things with you guys as it comes out. And um, I'm not sure how much else I can really share at the moment. I'll just say please pray for me as I continue doing this. I know I've been talking about this for a little bit here and there. I mentioned it. If you haven't caught it in the video, I've mentioned this a little bit here and there. But, um, I have to be patient. It takes a lot of time and a lot of work and a lot of research to dig up all the, all the data. And I don't want to talk about even who I'm looking into in some cases. I don't even want to mention that I'm looking into them because data will start disappearing and videos will start being removed from the Internet. And then I don't have. My research is going to be harder. So, um, some of the stuff I've mentioned, if you go look at my Twitter stuff, you can see and be like, wow, this is a different mic m than usual. Yeah, well, it is. But um, you know, we have different tools for different jobs and um, I'm doing a different kind of job right now. So that's, I guess about it. Thank you so much for your patience. As I'm working on that stuff, I'm working overtime, I'm working hard at it. And um, I'm grateful for the witnesses who've come forward, especially leaders, especially leaders who have come out and said, the group that I was part of, that I was even part of a leader, the leadership team. I got to tell the truth. This isn't okay.

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It won't self correct, it's too corrupt.

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And then they've been reaching out and talking with me and I'm grateful for them, uh, taking those risks. So I'll share this stuff with you in coming days. Um, thank you guys very much. Please do pray for that.

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Um, yeah, that's about it. All right, Lord bless you guys. Um, see you next Friday.

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I'm gonna pray. I was gonna pray.

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I started my little routine of what I do next. I haven't prayed. Let's pray.

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Father God, we. We thank you for, um, for your church that has been taught your word and that is also taught about justice and righteousness and about not having oppressive leaders and about not having elitism in the church and about exposing frauds and, uh, people who are like Simon the Sorcerer, who make it about money and think that they can use the Holy Spirit as their tool for fame. We pray they would be exposed. We pray that they'd be exposed by Christians. Not just by the world, but they'd be believers who say, we won't stand for this. We will clean our own house. And that we would then be able to move forward in the Spirit seeking you and honoring you and being a safe place for wounded and hurt people and not a safe place for those who are ongoingly victimizing others, that it would not be safe for them to be in our midst. In Jesus name, amen.

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Mhm.